Three Cases - Jen/Z/Themba

[Hambone]

I've only got 22 minutes to write this because Imprisonment is about to begin and we can't post during it!!! So I'm making this pretty quickly. Anyway, here we go, 3 cases on my main suspects right now.

Themba

Note: Z already started discussing you and why you are his main suspect. I'd like you to know that you are and have been my main suspect ever since the exile votes were revealed.

Themba says she was 50/50 on voting either Z/Alexei, and then 45/55, and 55/45, and so on. This gave her a very easy way to switch her vote whenever she wanted. She had her vote on Alexei and she believed he was a Spy... see below.


spies8zedekiah: I see, what were yer reasons fer suspectin (Alexei) so strongly then?
spies8themba: my main, convincing reason was the group chat where he basically laid down and died and admitted being maffy. doesn't take much more than that for me. he made an odd comment about lynching dane regardless of alliance, then that he believed steph's evidence but had no evidence of his own. then we pressed him, and in the end he just went ok then.
spies8zedekiah: so you reckon he was sure t' be scum, yet you changed yer vote t' me at the last second?
spies8themba: no i am not sure if anyone is scum.
spies8zedekiah: but ye jus claimed that he "admitted" his guilt.
spies8themba: it can never be a 100% case until they're dead and the alliance is revealed.


So Themba notices that Alexei seemed to have given up when he left the chatroom that one night (and I def. agreed with that), and she believes he was scum... and yet she switches her vote with only an hour left before exile?? Very suspicious.

AND TO ADD TO THAT...


spies8hambone: (12:04:48 AM)have u and alexei ever talked before
spies8hambone: (12:04:53 AM)like 1 on 1
spies8themba: (12:05:02 AM)never.
spies8hambone: (12:05:14 AM)wow
spies8themba: (12:05:29 AM)not once. and i am around a fair bit.


She believes that Alexei is a Spy and then she never goes and questions him or anything? I don't get it... Also, she never added to either Alexei's or Z's case, never posted on this board, and you'd only really hear her in the chatroom every so often. To me it seems like she switched her vote to Z last minute to hopefully save Alexei. I definitely don't buy at all that they have never talked... especially when Alexei was gaining votes, I know he came to me trying to convince me that he was a citizen and I know he went to Tina too, so why didn't he go to themba too? (I'm assuming he went to the rest of you guys too, right?)

Furthermore... (a couple hours after the time me and dane fought)


spies8hambone: (8:34:43 PM)who is ur main suspect right now
spies8themba: (8:43:09 PM)well i've popped my tentative vote in for dane, but i am reading the transcripts and the case against alexei now.
spies8themba: (8:43:28 PM)so i will have a better idea once i've read those, and caught up with what everyone's been saying in the burg.


So you go from No Exile to Dane to Z to Alexei to Z... uhhh. Yeah...

(I don't even want to get into the No Exile stuff because I was a believer of that at first -- but yeah, Dane's made his point on that... when he attacked her )

Jenny

Jenny voted for Z before a case had even been posted on Z if I remember correctly, but it was definitely before a case had been made on Alexei. First off, for someone as active as Jenny, I don't know why you'd have to vote so damned early. Secondly, why did she leave her vote on Z after everything we saw Alexei do. Yes, I totally believe Z WAS and IS suspicious, but she never voiced her opinions on Alexei or Z. She'd be all nice in the chatroom and in 1 on 1 conversations but you'd not see much spy hunting from her in my opinion. She just kind of voted based on things she saw but never told us what that even was. So I asked her about it...


pies8hambone: (11:38:29 PM) why did u never budge when u voted for Z
spies8jenny: (11:38:45 PM)Because I thought Zeddy was stranger then Lexi.
spies8hambone: (11:39:03 PM) how so
spies8jenny: (11:39:22 PM)Lexi could actually talk.
spies8jenny: (11:39:47 PM)Rather then making everyone die of confusion when asked what's supposed to be a simple question.


Because Z was "stranger than Alexei"... Personally I think that reason is ATROCIOUS and bullcrap. We don't vote for people based on strangeness, we vote based on FACTS of what people have done to make them suspicious. I think Z not knowing how to sign off AIM and then his story afterwards makes him strange as fuck, but I do not think that him acting like more of an idiot than Alexei deemed her more votable than Alexei. Personally I find Jenny never budging or announcing why she wasn't budging or adding to either case makes her very suspicious.

Another thing. And this is a stretch but I want it in this case just for the record. Whenever I message Jenny I will see her writing, and then stop, and then write again, and then stop, and it will take her like a whole 10 minutes sometimes just to answer a simple question. Is she trying to word everything perfectly or is that just me? It just happened now...


spies8jenny: (7:27:05 PM) Hi Hammy!
spies8hambone: (7:27:10 PM) hey
spies8jenny: (7:31:22 PM) Mind if I ask what makes you suspicious of me?


Right after I said "hey" I saw her typing and then stopping for a full 4 minutes. How long does it take someone to ask "HEY WHY DO YOU SUSPECT ME?"

CRAP ONE MINUTE TIL IMPRISONMENT AND I HAVE NOT FINISHED JENNY'S CASE OR EVEN BEGAN Z's BUT I HAVE TO POST THIS NOW...

[Hambone]

Just to conclude Jenny's case I wanted to add (did I already mention this? sort of but not really) that she is the most active of all of us, and she's always in and inviting people into the chatroom (which is GREAT), but she never adds anything to it other than nice comments and jokes and girly stuff. I messaged her one day when a LOT was happening in the chatroom just to see if she was actually watching the chatroom...

spies8hambone: (9:30:59 PM)so ur doing the same thing as me right now? :-)
spies8jenny: (9:31:20 PM)Just staying out of it because they're making me want to sad face? Probably.


So she was there and just watching.

I suck at making cases, and even points on people I suspect, so people feel free to add to my case or whatever you want. Jenny and Themba, feel free to reply whenever you can.

Z, I will get to you later, but most of what I was going to address has already been addressed, so I might just ask you 1 on 1 in my own words...

[Jenny]

Give me a little bit, and I'll respond to your points in here.

Jenny voted for Z before a case had even been posted on Z if I remember correctly, but it was definitely before a case had been made on Alexei.

I actually never put in my vote until Saturday, but yes I was rather suspicious of Zeddy since that first crazy group chat with Zeddy. I talked with a few people about it on AIM, just never bothered to post about it.

First off, for someone as active as Jenny, I don't know why you'd have to vote so damned early. Secondly, why did she leave her vote on Z after everything we saw Alexei do. Yes, I totally believe Z WAS and IS suspicious, but she never voiced her opinions on Alexei or Z. She'd be all nice in the chatroom and in 1 on 1 conversations but you'd not see much spy hunting from her in my opinion. She just kind of voted based on things she saw but never told us what that even was. So I asked her about it...

I mostly voiced my opinions about it to people in one on one chats. I just checked my chat logs, it looks like the two of us only really talked about Zeddy back on Thursday during the actual chat, and by the time we talked about Lexi, he was already in giving up mode. I thought I had talked more about it with you before hence...


pies8hambone: (11:38:29 PM) why did u never budge when u voted for Z
spies8jenny: (11:38:45 PM)Because I thought Zeddy was stranger then Lexi.
spies8hambone: (11:39:03 PM) how so
spies8jenny: (11:39:22 PM)Lexi could actually talk.
spies8jenny: (11:39:47 PM)Rather then making everyone die of confusion when asked what's supposed to be a simple question.


... why I was fairly simple about my reason here. I thought I had already told it to you, and was just repeating myself. Sorry bout that. I never bothered to change my vote because while Lexi was also rather odd sounding, he reminded me of another person that played that turned out to be cit, and I wanted to wait an exile on him to make sure it wasn't going to be a repeat of the same mistake. I didn't mind that we had votes on Lexi, I just would have prefered to see Zeddy cleared up first.

Because Z was "stranger than Alexei"... Personally I think that reason is ATROCIOUS and bullcrap. We don't vote for people based on strangeness, we vote based on FACTS of what people have done to make them suspicious. I think Z not knowing how to sign off AIM and then his story afterwards makes him strange as fuck, but I do not think that him acting like more of an idiot than Alexei deemed her more votable than Alexei. Personally I find Jenny never budging or announcing why she wasn't budging or adding to either case makes her very suspicious.

Another thing. And this is a stretch but I want it in this case just for the record. Whenever I message Jenny I will see her writing, and then stop, and then write again, and then stop, and it will take her like a whole 10 minutes sometimes just to answer a simple question. Is she trying to word everything perfectly or is that just me? It just happened now...


spies8jenny: (7:27:05 PM) Hi Hammy!
spies8hambone: (7:27:10 PM) hey
spies8jenny: (7:31:22 PM) Mind if I ask what makes you suspicious of me?


Right after I said "hey" I saw her typing and then stopping for a full 4 minutes. How long does it take someone to ask "HEY WHY DO YOU SUSPECT ME?"

This is just meebo being weird. My version of that chat looks like

[19:27] spies8jenny: Hi Hammy!
[19:27] spies8hambone: hey
[19:27] spies8jenny: How are you?
[19:27] Meebo Message: Could not IM buddy
[19:31] spies8jenny: Mind if I ask what makes you suspicious of me?

I didn't see that my second message didn't go through until a couple minutes later, and decided to poke again. It saying I'm still writing is news to me, but it's likely from whatever it is that is making Meebo not send some of my messages. It happens once in a while, it's rather annoying.


Just to conclude Jenny's case I wanted to add (did I already mention this? sort of but not really) that she is the most active of all of us, and she's always in and inviting people into the chatroom (which is GREAT), but she never adds anything to it other than nice comments and jokes and girly stuff. I messaged her one day when a LOT was happening in the chatroom just to see if she was actually watching the chatroom...

spies8hambone: (9:30:59 PM)so ur doing the same thing as me right now?
spies8jenny: (9:31:20 PM)Just staying out of it because they're making me want to sad face? Probably.


So she was there and just watching.

Well if you're ever curious about what I'm thinking with something in the room, go ahead and ask me. Most of the time I am actually reading the chat, and just don't have anything to add besides the odd comment.

[Hambone]

Thanks Jenny. This certainly clears up some things but obviously you cannot clear up things you have already done, even if you word them in a way that doesn't make them look so bad. I still suspect you, but I'm more curious to hear from Themba right now.

[Themba]

Jun 22, 2010 18:00:04 GMT -6 Hambone said:

Anyway, here we go, 3 cases on my main suspects right now.
Themba

Note: Z already started discussing you and why you are his main suspect. I'd like you to know that you are and have been my main suspect ever since the exile votes were revealed.

Themba says she was 50/50 on voting either Z/Alexei, and then 45/55, and 55/45, and so on. This gave her a very easy way to switch her vote whenever she wanted. She had her vote on Alexei and she believed he was a Spy... see below.


spies8zedekiah: I see, what were yer reasons fer suspectin (Alexei) so strongly then?
spies8themba: my main, convincing reason was the group chat where he basically laid down and died and admitted being maffy. doesn't take much more than that for me. he made an odd comment about lynching dane regardless of alliance, then that he believed steph's evidence but had no evidence of his own. then we pressed him, and in the end he just went ok then.
spies8zedekiah: so you reckon he was sure t' be scum, yet you changed yer vote t' me at the last second?
spies8themba: no i am not sure if anyone is scum.
spies8zedekiah: but ye jus claimed that he "admitted" his guilt.
spies8themba: it can never be a 100% case until they're dead and the alliance is revealed.


So Themba notices that Alexei seemed to have given up when he left the chatroom that one night (and I def. agreed with that), and she believes he was scum... and yet she switches her vote with only an hour left before exile?? Very suspicious.

AND TO ADD TO THAT...


spies8hambone: (12:04:48 AM)have u and alexei ever talked before
spies8hambone: (12:04:53 AM)like 1 on 1
spies8themba: (12:05:02 AM)never.
spies8hambone: (12:05:14 AM)wow
spies8themba: (12:05:29 AM)not once. and i am around a fair bit.


She believes that Alexei is a Spy and then she never goes and questions him or anything? I don't get it... Also, she never added to either Alexei's or Z's case , never posted on this board, and you'd only really hear her in the chatroom every so often. To me it seems like she switched her vote to Z last minute to hopefully save Alexei. I definitely don't buy at all that they have never talked... especially when Alexei was gaining votes, I know he came to me trying to convince me that he was a citizen and I know he went to Tina too, so why didn't he go to themba too? (I'm assuming he went to the rest of you guys too, right?)

Furthermore... (a couple hours after the time me and dane fought)


spies8hambone: (8:34:43 PM)who is ur main suspect right now
spies8themba: (8:43:09 PM)well i've popped my tentative vote in for dane, but i am reading the transcripts and the case against alexei now.
spies8themba: (8:43:28 PM)so i will have a better idea once i've read those, and caught up with what everyone's been saying in the burg.


So you go from No Exile to Dane to Z to Alexei to Z... uhhh. Yeah...

(I don't even want to get into the No Exile stuff because I was a believer of that at first -- but yeah, Dane's made his point on that... when he attacked her )

"I'd like you to know that you are and have been my main suspect ever since the exile votes were revealed."
What do you mean revealed? My vote/s have been 'revealed' since the start of the game. I pick someone, I vote them, I tell them why, and I post it on the Group Vote Thread. Good to know though ~ explains why you haven't come and said hello lately.

"Themba says she was 50/50 on voting either Z/Alexei, and then 45/55, and 55/45, and so on. This gave her a very easy way to switch her vote whenever she wanted."
And what's wrong with that? You're making the assumption that Zed is a Citizen then? I don't think you are, as you've listed him as one of your own suspects. So why would switching between one known Spy and one very possible Spy, be a bad thing?

"So Themba notices that Alexei seemed to have given up when he left the chatroom that one night (and I def. agreed with that), and she believes he was scum... and yet she switches her vote with only an hour left before exile?? Very suspicious."
You agreed with that too Hambone? Why didn't you say anything until after I said it?
Again, this is not suspicious if Zed is indeed a Spy. Actually, it's not really suspicious in general. Citizens don't know who Spies are until they're killed off. Anyone who was 100% certain that Alexei was a Spy would be more of a concern.

"She believes that Alexei is a Spy and then she never goes and questions him or anything?"
He was never on AIM at the same time I was after he flew onto the radar. The one time I did get to speak to him, was in fact the one time I did chat to him about his thoughts.

"she never added to either Alexei's or Z's case"
What a load of doo-doo. I discussed Alexei's thoughts and actions towards Dane in the group chat before and after he left. I was the second person behind Dane to vote for his "exile a cit anyway" comment, and I was the first to vote him for laying down like a good Spy should. In terms of Zed, I have discussed with several people ideas and things to look out for with him, none of which need to be posted here. When he has said odd things in the Group chats, you'll notice my reactions to them are one of the first. I changed to him, stating some original thoughts and adding new ones I gleaned from that chat an hour before Exile. Moreoever, where are your contributions?

"never posted on this board"
Never? Really? Hmmmm. Must be 2 Thembas in this game. I have posted every single time I changed my vote, with reasons why. There's not too many other boards which need posting on. Well there wasn't until now. And now there is more to post on, I am posting. Dunno what your point was here.

"you'd only really hear her in the chatroom every so often"
I talk when I have something to say. I listen when I need to listen. I answer and ask questions when it's required. I don't say stupid things just for the sake I am making sure everyone knows I am there.

"I know he came to me trying to convince me that he was a citizen and I know he went to Tina too, so why didn't he go to themba too?"
Maybe he just went to you two because he thought he could convince you. There were more than just Tina, you and myself who were planning on voting for him. The fact that he stopped by to check in with you two doesn't really reveal all that much. There's no auto-clearance, if that's what you're after.

"So you go from No Exile to Dane to Z to Alexei to Z... uhhh. Yeah..."
Never said I was voting No Exile. Never changed from Dane to Zed. Themba's vote pattern for Episode 1:
Dane > Alexei > Zed.



And now for some questions of my own.

1) Did you and Zed get together and come up with these points? Or did you come up with them on your own?

2) Tell me where you've fostered an argument on anyone until now. You're pushing a possible vote for me, yet you've done nothing but jump on the thoughts of others yourself. Let's look at your reasons for voting Alexei:

Jun 19, 2010 23:09:50 GMT -6 Hambone said:

I am going to vote for ALEXEI for now. Once I'm back from Father's Day stuff if a better option arises then I will definitely be up for switching my vote though, but based on the case that the anagram alliance (Tina/Nita) presented as well as Dane/Alexei's fight earlier, and this....

[22:54] spies8alexei: Also, I hope you understand that I am not taking any of this personally, and I do not blame you or think any less of any of you. I know the nature of this game, and if I took everything seriously, no one would play with me. I appreciate your honesty, and I hope that one day I will get to play with all of you again one day
[22:55] spies8alexei: and with that, I have to leave. Goodbye, my friends, for perhaps the last time
[22:56] spies8zedekiah: ya ain't comin to chat before exile?
[22:56] spies8zedekiah: bye
[22:56] spies8themba: Bye Alexei
[22:56] spies8gabriel: bye!!
[22:56] spies8gabriel: come see us before exile. D:
[22:58] spies8alexei: I will, of course, I forgot about that
[22:58] spies8alexei: until then
[22:58] spies8alexei: I bid you farewell]
[22:58] spies8jenny: Have a good night!
[22:58] spies8alexei: you too
[22:59] spies8alexei: and, once again, I appreciate your honesty.
[22:59] spies8alexei: has left the chat
[22:59] spies8themba: did he just admit to being a spy? or was that just me?
[22:59] spies8jenny: I don't think so.
[23:00] spies8jenny: I think he was just semi-depressed about possibly being the first gone.
[23:00] spies8jenny: I know I would be.
[23:00] spies8themba: true. but i reckon he is and did.


Which definitely DOES sound like Alexei is basically saying "Okay I gotta go guys, good job, you guys got me, no hard feelings", and that we've caught him and he surrenders.

I don't see where you've contributed anything. Please correct me if I am wrong.

3) Is this still your MO for the rest of the game:

spies8themba 10:33 am
yeah i haven't met him either actually. just struck me as an odd thing to say. i'll add it into my confessional and ask him about it later.
who are you looking at at the moment? anyone in particular?
spies8hambone 10:34 am
not rly no
if i had to vote based on gut feelings
id vote for owen
spies8themba 10:34 am
whyso? i haven't him yet either. apart from this group chat now.
spies8hambone 10:35 am
just cuz ive never met him and idk, its a gut feeling, there is no reason =P

4) Why have you not come to me on AIM and asked me about my actions? Are you afraid of discussing this with me one on one? Several others have approached me directly which gives me a chance to address them immediately, yet you don't seem to be a fan of this idea. Why?


Thoughts:
- Maybe he and Zed are working together on a super plan to get me exiled next episode. LOOOOL.

[Hambone]

Jun 22, 2010 20:23:08 GMT -6 Themba said:

And now for some questions of my own.

.5) I don't see where you've contributed anything. Please correct me if I am wrong.

1) Did you and Zed get together and come up with these points? Or did you come up with them on your own?

2) Tell me where you've fostered an argument on anyone until now. You're pushing a possible vote for me, yet you've done nothing but jump on the thoughts of others yourself.

3) Is this still your MO for the rest of the game:

spies8themba 10:33 am
yeah i haven't met him either actually. just struck me as an odd thing to say. i'll add it into my confessional and ask him about it later.
who are you looking at at the moment? anyone in particular?
spies8hambone 10:34 am
not rly no
if i had to vote based on gut feelings
id vote for owen
spies8themba 10:34 am
whyso? i haven't him yet either. apart from this group chat now.
spies8hambone 10:35 am
just cuz ive never met him and idk, its a gut feeling, there is no reason =P

.5) I was talking about that Alexei case well before the majority of people voted for him. On the SECOND DAY of the game I even asked Alexei "why he was pushing so HARD on Z"... and he said...

spies8alexei: (6:42:02 PM)I may be too aggressive on the lynch thing, I know, but, I suppose that's how I play

This was my second conversation ever with Alexei... I was suspecting and talking to others (Tina/Nita mainly) about Alexei since the second day of the game. If you need me to pull up convos with other players for that early on I can.

Also, what's wrong with AGREEING to a very solid case?? When Tina (or nita?) explaned to me the case on Alexei for the first time, the first thing I said to it was "wow thats a brilliant case!".

1.) Lol no, Z and I did not come up with our cases together. I was going to post my case the same day he was but I got distracted with work. We were both thinking generally the same thing about you at the time. Both our cases are very similar, but there are a lot of differences in opinions in both too.

2.) In this case right now there's a case on Jenny AND You. I suspected Alexei and Z during the first week. Right now I also suspect Allan based on stuff he literally just said to me... Just because I don't post all my thoughts into cases on this board does not mean I'm not making cases. I speak to certain people privately because I trust they are citizens and that they can help me. I'm sure I'm not the only one who does this.

3.) My "MO" if you are asking me if I still have gut feelings towards Owen, then yes, I do. As me and Owen discussed, gut feelings just don't go away sometimes. I still suspect him, but I've got no facts to make a case on him, and right now there are at least 4-5 other people I suspect over him.

Anythin else?

[Themba]

Not about me no.

But bring on the Allan info.

[Dane]

2.) In this case right now there's a case on Jenny AND You. I suspected Alexei and Z during the first week. Right now I also suspect Allan based on stuff he literally just said to me... Just because I don't post all my thoughts into cases on this board does not mean I'm not making cases. I speak to certain people privately because I trust they are citizens and that they can help me. I'm sure I'm not the only one who does this.

Be VEEEEEEERY cautious about this. Information is to be SHARED among citizens and CONTROLLED by spies. Citizens who HOARD usually end up hurting the town. For example, please take a look back at "Queen Bitch Cassidy" from Spies 7.

Episode 2 is way too early to be able to trust someone so much that you only share info with them. People need ALL the info the make educated votes.

[Hambone]

It's usually about showing some people my case before I post it, for early reactions mainly, so I can strengthen a case... but not all the time. Dually noted, Douchey Dane The. End.