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Post by Broderick on Jun 19, 2010 18:00:18 GMT -6
Describe your suspicions here please. Whether or not you plan on voting for them.
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Post by Chance on Jun 19, 2010 18:01:57 GMT -6
i am suspicious of claude for the following reasons.
one - he was eager to hammer on tina and cory when i was mistaken about them earlier, after previously pseudo-defending both.
two - he is apparently suspicious of tina for not bringing up her suspicion of hal publically, yet until pressed he did not bring up his suspicion of tina publically.
three - he absolutely began the whole deflecting business on camilla.
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Post by Broderick on Jun 19, 2010 18:59:45 GMT -6
For the record. After last night I was suspicious of Claude due to his contradictions and Chance for his fence riding.
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Post by Isaac on Jun 20, 2010 1:36:40 GMT -6
As of right now I have some concerns with claude as stated in the vote tallies thread and from comments between him and Jasmine. Chance seems a little...well, off. Nothing personal and I can't put my finger on it but he seems to be in all the big conversations and commenting on both sides, so really observant and concerned or overly worried about other things. Either way, can't tell. And lileth just because I haven't talked to you. Not really a suspicion I know, but would love to have at least a chance to chat sometime soon so I could get a reading.
For right now thats all I have and it isn't much at all. Hopefully day 2 will be more productive and everyone will have chatted with eachother by then.
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Post by Mary on Jun 20, 2010 12:10:30 GMT -6
i am suspicious of claude for the following reasons. one - he was eager to hammer on tina and cory when i was mistaken about them earlier, after previously pseudo-defending both. two - he is apparently suspicious of tina for not bringing up her suspicion of hal publically, yet until pressed he did not bring up his suspicion of tina publically. three - he absolutely began the whole deflecting business on camilla. Chance, when did Tina express suspicion of Awohali? Was it before or after the teams were split? Because if it was before, then her situation seems different here from Claude's situation. Claude isn't really obliged to bring up his suspicions of people on the other team at this point, and I don't think that makes him hypocritical. Also, in the context of: spies8chance (16:58:31): one - he was eager to hammer on tina and cory when i was mistaken about them earlier, after previously pseudo-defending both. spies8claude (17:00:1): I was already suspicious of them both, which I had obviously told to you. Your point(which I later found out was a mistake), amde them seem 100 times worse. It is naturally for me to get MORE suspicious of them at that point. Please provide evidence of me ever defending them, as the idea that I ever defended Cory is laughable. This is not the first time people have gone "off track" based on inaccurate things you've said. I'm looking for your misstatement in question to see whether it's reasonable for Claude to leap on it to further his suspicions of Tina and Cory. Can you please paste it here, because I think it's directly relevant to whether your point (1) is valid. I recall that you made misstatements about me as well, and Claude and Broderick ran with them a bit: spies8chance: (10:36:54 PM)i think mary would say you've avoided questions, but we'll have to wait for her to know for sure. spies8chance: (10:49:43 PM)who did we hear that 'cory is pushing people for information without volunteering any of his own' from? spies8chance: (10:49:44 PM)mary. The reactions of three people you misled were a little different, but similar in the important ways. Claude seemed to accept your incorrect statements to an extent and proceeded to relay them. He did however attempt to verify them when I arrived that night, and seemed to accept that they had been fed to him falsely. Broderick seemed more focused in his questioning of me on verifying your statements, and he seemed frustrated when they proved incorrect. He did attribute a incorrect statement as fact once, but seemed skeptical and backed off it fairly quickly. Cory could have come after me for the "false statements" about him attributed to me, but his initial reaction seemed to be doubt/disbelief. spies8cinnamyn: (10:32:28 PM)sum1 said u "grilled" mary 4 information, cory. did u.? spies8cinnamyn: (10:32:30 PM)or r dey mistaken spies8cory: (10:32:35 PM)Um. I don't think so? spies8cory: (10:32:39 PM)Not Mary. He didn't attack me, but rather seemed to dismiss the source. Cinnamyn also seeked to verify. Anyhow, my original point was that I have been watching how people respond to incorrect information from you, Chance. Claude was somewhat more aggressive in pursuing it than the others. I still find it suspect that you provide bad information and then blame others for acting upon it. For the most part, the chats I read show people making an effort to verify your incorrect statements and then backing down from attacks when the information proves wrong. Which is reasonable on their parts. |
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Post by Chance on Jun 20, 2010 13:02:48 GMT -6
i don't consider this to be inaccurate. if you do, we'll have to agree to disagree.
also, yes, i was in error about the timing of hal's comment about the no-exile. i think we've been over that.
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Post by Claude on Jun 20, 2010 14:50:40 GMT -6
Camilla makes the two following statements:
No matter how much Camilla wants to say otherwise, there is an obvious logical contradiction between these two statements. In the first statement, she says that there are 'other alternatives' to voting someone that you don't think is a spy(as opposed to no lynch). Of course, she doesn't illustrate what those alternatives are.
In the second statement, she completely barns Chance's completely scummy idea that it's okay to 'lynch someone that might not be a spy because they're being unhelpful'. This is in contradiction with her first statement, period. First she said that you shouldn't lynch someone that you don't think is a spy. Then she immediately follows with saying it's okay to lynch someone that might not be a spy 'If they're being helpful'. It is very apparent that she is just talking out both sides of her mouth. She perceives my statement as bad, and responds negatively. She perceives Chance's statement(because she doesn't know any better) as okay, and responds positively. She clearly misses that they are largely the same statement/sentiment.
In my estimation, she is trying to make the statement that appears most like what a citizen would say in each instance, and fails to grasp that she is offering contradictory sentiments.
I noticed this, and it bothered me. Not enough to say anything, but I made a note of it. Then she came into chat. At first, I was talking about Cory, while Broderick was mostly talking to/about me.
Camilla had the following to say:
I was in the middle of talking to Broderick at the time, so I didn't notice it right away. So I asked her to clarify. She says:
I find this to be strange, considering that she has said absolutely nothing about Cory before this. Ultimately, this vote felt like a complete bandwagon vote. I decided to press more here, and asked Camilla about the forums posts that I mentioned above.
Here are her responses:
That last sentence is particularly relevant. She disagreed with my notion, which involved the possibility of lynching someone that might be a citizen, but readily goes along with lynching a citizen 'hf they are no help to you'. She also says that the 'ghosts' are always exiled first in a game of mafia. I presume that ghosts = lurkers, because I don't see what else she could be talking about. Not only is this completely untrue, it is also completely terrible. Lurkers almost never get lynched first. Nor should they; lurker lynches are terrible early in the game.
The next thing she says is:
This is where Camilla starts to fall apart. This statement is a tremendous change in perspective from previously, where she was actually trying to explain herself. Now, she starts attacking me personally. For one thing, I am not deflecting here. Before I started questioning Camilla, Broderick and Chance had been going at it for awhile. I was no longer the center of attention. It is also worth noting that she accused me of deflecting, while she is doing so herself, with this statement.
Camilla continues to fall apart, and is starting to just throw whatever accusation she can at me. I couldn't have deflected onto Cory, because as Camilla says herself, I've been suspicious of him since Day 1. Also, worth noting is that Camilla didn't feel inclined to point out that this 'deflection' earlier, when she went along with my case on Cory and said she was '50/50' on him.
A bit later, we had the following conversation:
Note, she never addresses my 'Why'. She instead attacks the fact that I was 'making a case on how she worded things'(which, while somewhat true, was not the entire truth, as I explained). She also miscontrues my 'playing up to the citizens' statement..severely. Clearly I'm not calling her out for expressing her opinion. All people really do is the express their opinion, in the game of mafia.
We have some back and forth next, which is largely rendered useless by Chance again coming in to defend Camilla. Again, he should not have done so, but the damage is done now. The next relevant thing that Camilla says is:
Camilla is in full-on collapse mode now. This statement is hugely OMGUS, which again, is a tactic that bad scum try to use(instead of logically addressing the points against them, they try to just make their attacker look weaker).
Once again, Camilla continues to fall apart, resorting to calling me names now.
And finally:
Putting aside that Camilla doesn't know what 'bus' means in the context of mafia, this is the last ditch effort of a scum that feels trapped in the corner. This post, and defeatism period, are simply not town sentiments. When you are town, you fight until your dying breath. Giving up is just doing a disservice to your team. If they lynch you anyway, then that is unfortunate. But you still try. This is particularly relevant because I was the only person remotely expressing suspicion toward Camilla. She failed to defend herself adequately, and she clearly knows it. Because she is a Spy.
Here she calls me delusional..just more of the same personal attacking from before, and more defeatism/trying to get out of our discussion.
More OMGUS.
Everything after this is really just re-hashing.
Camilla is as scum as they get. If you didn't realize it before, hopefully you do now.
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Post by Magalie on Jun 20, 2010 16:39:37 GMT -6
I suspect Gertrude. I just have a feeling but I dont know how to put it in words.
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Cory
Cory
Hot Because He's Fly
Posts: 127
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Post by Cory on Jun 20, 2010 17:21:08 GMT -6
Lol is that all we get?
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Post by Awohali on Jun 20, 2010 17:24:14 GMT -6
She's got a feeling....
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Post by Claude on Jun 20, 2010 17:52:33 GMT -6
I suspect Gertrude. I just have a feeling but I dont know how to put it in words. There's been alot of content for 3 day period(and Day 1 especially). This is really all you have to contribute? |
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Post by Broderick on Jun 20, 2010 20:40:41 GMT -6
For the record.
I am pointing a Finger of Suspicion [FoS] at :
Margot and Gertie - Both of your votes are rather bandwagonesque. Have either of you spoken to Camilla directly in an attempt to hear from her? I assume not as you both said something similar to 'I agree with the things said about her.'
Jasmine - Your vote looks bandwagonesque as well. Both Chance and Claude have been in the limelight. I noticed that when Awohali asked for your reasons for voting for Chance, you could not readily supply examples. You had to go looking for them. Given you plan on voting for him, why would you not have the evidence selected out somewhere?
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Post by Magalie on Jun 20, 2010 20:43:43 GMT -6
I suspect Gertrude. I just have a feeling but I dont know how to put it in words. There's been alot of content for 3 day period(and Day 1 especially). This is really all you have to contribute? yes that is all I fuggin have to contribute I was not here the last 3 days because my family comes first so atleast you know Im fuggin still here. shit man get the fuck off my back. |
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